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boomnoise
Joined: 07 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:14 pm Post subject: DJ/Rupture on Grime / Dubstep |
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Great piece.
negrophonic.com/words/archives/archive_2006-m09.php#e420
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elgato
Joined: 22 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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very interesting thoughts, and wonderfully written
agree mostly, but there seems too much determinism about what dubstep 'does'... it perhaps almost always does in practice ("cut out the body, leave a trace in hopes that the aura remains"), but the language used doesnt seem to leave open any artistic potential in sampling and recontextualising vocals (ala Stone Cold, Dem2 etc)
but its true say, too many arbitrary dub/dread signifiers around these parts
its all about answer by pinch... he's not fucking about with that one. i'll be very interested to hear the original to see what happened in between. likewise with cay's cray... two of the deepest tunes going, and theres a good reason (other than two of the deepest producers being behind them!) |
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smog
Joined: 05 Aug 2006
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Location: los angeles, ca
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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| how does something like anti-war dub fit in? i don't think the message or impact is lost in that vocal sample. |
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riff
Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Dublin
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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rupture is always interesting, always worth a read
suppose he is right when he is talking about the instrumental vs vocal styles if you look at it from his specific point of view, but from a depoliticised viewpoint I think his point works less well. not that it is possible, but if you could decontextualise music and react to it purely as sound then I think dubstep is a much ritcher aural environment than grime. to use the slightly tired virus analogy once again, more than any other genre I have come across, dubstep has mutated and developed new sounds, textures and structures - I mean to take just 3 examples: dmz, skream and kode 9 - they all come under the dubstep banner but they all sound so utterly different. this, for me, is just one of the reasons that makes dubstep so astonishingly exciting.
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doomstep
Joined: 13 Oct 2005
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Location: Pt. Adelaide
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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Its funny elgato, he builds a sound argument then blows holes in it by posting that Wiley/Various bit, Rupture is great like that, I never get the feeling hes looking for any kind final destination, always moving.
Its interesting he compares the use of JA samples in dubstep & breakcore. I can see the link but I dunno. I def dont get a "downloaded accappela" vibe from Mala or Coki tunes.
hhhmmm now wheres that beardy, chin stroking smiley at........ |
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UFO over easy
Joined: 17 Oct 2005
Posts: 1628
Location: London W5/Leeds LS6
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:05 pm Post subject: |
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Cool article. Nicely written, and I like the way he treats controversial issues.. good example of criticism that isn't completely obnoxious
| doomstep wrote: | Its interesting he compares the use of JA samples in dubstep & breakcore. I can see the link but I dunno. I def dont get a "downloaded accappela" vibe from Mala or Coki tunes.
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I can only actually think of one released tune that has a 'downloaded acapella' vibe to it, and that's the one he mentions - Way Of The Dub. But if you ask me with that tune it adds something, as the best thing about it is that it's like a mashup gone dubstep. That kind of happy-go-lucky cut and paste style of production that I used to love about jungle..
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doomstep
Joined: 13 Oct 2005
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Location: Pt. Adelaide
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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yeah Ben, for sure, but that tune feels so 'properlly' Jungle influenced to me, and so naturally so, like you say, which I think is to do more with the elemnts that aren't vocal samples
this is what I find so endlessly fascinating about sampling in general, sounds are free from there origins, because technology makes it so easy for them to be, but at the same time carry the wieght of those origins. |
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municiple
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Posts: 235
Location: Chicago!
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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Dub is version.
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narcossist
Joined: 07 May 2006
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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yeah interesting stuff.
my interpretation was that rupture sees the use of patois samples as a cheap shortcut which removes the words from their context and offers little in the way of enhanced meaning and this dub posturing makes tracks less enjoyable to him.
Think if the arguement is that using traditional dub sounds/samples is merely a lazy attempt to emulate others the point is lost. When producing a tune, at least from my perspective, the idea is to get people moving using whatever is available to you - standardly a sequencer, a few synths and a hd full of samples.
If a "dub signifier" sounds good to me i'll use it: the analytic or political impications of having done so ne'r cross my mind. I'd love to be able to afford to pay someone and hire the studio time to record real meaningful vocals, or have a rack full of hardware so dope that i wasn't just building sample collages with basslines, but its simply not financially practical.
Genericism is obviously a bad thing for any scene but i've yet to hear of anyone complain about the overuse of sub/drums/bongos/wobble bass/ atmosphere or any of the other cornerstones of dubstep. Sampling is an essential part of electronic music and adds imo an important organic element.
Sorry got a bit carried away there.......
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UFO over easy
Joined: 17 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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| doomstep wrote: | yeah Ben, for sure, but that tune feels so 'properlly' Jungle influenced to me, and so naturally so, like you say, which I think is to do more with the elemnts that aren't vocal samples
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